[Jask]

A friend and I decided to do glass cannon builds. Put everything into one damage stat. Completely ignore all other stats with the exception of meeting weapon requirements. He chose dex while I chose strength. It's been pretty amazing so far. I killed the first gargoyle in two hits. At level 29 I had 629 attack power. I did make the mistake of putting one point into dex early on so I could use the zweihander, but now I've found that the stronger srength weapons don't require any dex.

Unfortunately, I've peaked. It seems most weapons (only exception I could find was the dragon bone fist) stop increasing at 66 strength. Five more strength and my damage wouldn't move any higher than its current 666. According to a stat planner, even going to 99 wouldn't increase it. So now I'm at a bit of a loss. 57 isn't exactly prime for PvP, and I want to improve this character further, but I'm not sure what to do now. I've just been focusing on strength strength strength, was planning to get it to 99. I could always raise vit and end, but that would break the glass cannon idea, and it just feels like there should be something else I could do.He's supposed to be completely focused on damage, so he can do unexpected amounts for his level. I guess I could work on getting one of the weapon enchantments, like crystal magic weapon...

[Basukesu]

Jask, on 13 January 2012 - 09:13 AM, said:

A friend and I decided to do glass cannon builds. Put everything into one damage stat. Completely ignore all other stats with the exception of meeting weapon requirements. He chose dex while I chose strength. It's been pretty amazing so far. I killed the first gargoyle in two hits. At level 29 I had 629 attack power. I did make the mistake of putting one point into dex early on so I could use the zweihander, but now I've found that the stronger srength weapons don't require any dex.

Unfortunately, I've peaked. It seems most weapons (only exception I could find was the dragon bone fist) stop increasing at 66 strength. Five more strength and my damage wouldn't move any higher than its current 666. According to a stat planner, even going to 99 wouldn't increase it. So now I'm at a bit of a loss. 57 isn't exactly prime for PvP, and I want to improve this character further, but I'm not sure what to do now. I've just been focusing on strength strength strength, was planning to get it to 99. I could always raise vit and end, but that would break the glass cannon idea, and it just feels like there should be something else I could do.He's supposed to be completely focused on damage, so he can do unexpected amounts for his level. I guess I could work on getting one of the weapon enchantments, like crystal magic weapon...

Yah I figured out early on that strength only as the modifier has diminishing returns earlier than if you have an effect with the weapon. Problem with that too is though no matter what you scale a weapon with it eventually hits diminishing returns and I am not sure how much the damage stacks at this point (say enchanted/magic weapon that scales to INT + STR) I am sure both are taken into account but even on weapons that cap on stats at lower levels I don't really see that big of a difference.

Maybe my builds are wonky though. But that is what I seem to observe. Though I have seen a friend of mine buff up on Intelligence and get Big Hats Silver w/e catalyst and he hits for over 1000 dmg. with just the starter attack magic, and gets even sicker as he goes to higher level sorceries. Again all Magic, though. I have a hard time getting 600dmg out of my fully upgraded scaled to STR and fire enchanted sword ><

[Jask]

Basukesu, on 12 January 2012 - 06:46 PM, said:

Yah I figured out early on that strength only as the modifier has diminishing returns earlier than if you have an effect with the weapon. Problem with that too is though no matter what you scale a weapon with it eventually hits diminishing returns and I am not sure how much the damage stacks at this point (say enchanted/magic weapon that scales to INT + STR) I am sure both are taken into account but even on weapons that cap on stats at lower levels I don't really see that big of a difference.

Maybe my builds are wonky though. But that is what I seem to observe. Though I have seen a friend of mine buff up on Intelligence and get Big Hats Silver w/e catalyst and he hits for over 1000 dmg. with just the starter attack magic, and gets even sicker as he goes to higher level sorceries. Again all Magic, though. I have a hard time getting 600dmg out of my fully upgraded scaled to STR and fire enchanted sword ><

Oh, I know about diminishing returns. Most stats hit that at 40. After that, damage increases drop sharply, stamina stops rising, etc. Resistance has some sort of level cap, making it lower, and attunement has its own scaling. What I'm talking about isn't diminishing returns, it's a hard cap. Going from 66 to 99 would not increase the damage on my great club at all. Not one point.

[Basukesu]

Jask, on 13 January 2012 - 02:34 PM, said:

Oh, I know about diminishing returns. Most stats hit that at 40. After that, damage increases drop sharply, stamina stops rising, etc. Resistance has some sort of level cap, making it lower, and attunement has its own scaling. What I'm talking about isn't diminishing returns, it's a hard cap. Going from 66 to 99 would not increase the damage on my great club at all. Not one point.

Ewww. Seems like they just gave up to keep the PVP reasonable. Though maybe they should tier it two ways for PVE and PVP. Wonder if they can adjust the algorithm with a new patch....

[LoneSyndal]

Remember that From Software did not make the game mainly multiplayer, its a simple add-on. The game is mostly a single player experience, so they wont bother with balancing PvP all too much.


As for the Glass Cannon thing, that's been a Demon's Souls staple... You maximize one stat, then fill up whatever you want till you reach PvP range. In your case, you're fitted for low-level invasions in Anor Londo (65 range) or some fights in the Kiln. Since you're an STR build with no spells or miracles, might as well do END or VIT to make up for it. There are people who can one shot anyone at your level with one hit from Crystal Magic Weapon.

[Jask]

LoneSyndal, on 13 January 2012 - 10:03 AM, said:

Remember that From Software did not make the game mainly multiplayer, its a simple add-on. The game is mostly a single player experience, so they wont bother with balancing PvP all too much.

This does affect single player too, just not until a few playthroughs in. The enemies will keep getting stronger, but suddenly it becomes very hard to increase your damage.

LoneSyndal, on 13 January 2012 - 10:03 AM, said:

As for the Glass Cannon thing, that's been a Demon's Souls staple... You maximize one stat, then fill up whatever you want till you reach PvP range. In your case, you're fitted for low-level invasions in Anor Londo (65 range) or some fights in the Kiln. Since you're an STR build with no spells or miracles, might as well do END or VIT to make up for it. There are people who can one shot anyone at your level with one hit from Crystal Magic Weapon.

For this character I was planning on completely maximising the stat, 99, which would have put me just intot he high PvP range. Forest still works for me at this level, though it might not be the best for souls.

Cool thing about the Blade of the Darkmoon: the harder it is to invade, the more exciting it is when you do.

[SemajChaos]

Ok was there some sort of patch I wasn't aware I downloaded? Or what's up with the Forest lately? -.- I thought it might be my connection, but it ONLY happens in the Forest. No where else. And not all of it either. Just the part between the Artorias doors. And only when I am alive. I get summoned to other people and we don't even get invaded for upwards of an hour....

Irritated rant

Spoiler

Almost all of my summons fail (only when I'm summoning someone else, not the other way around) and I ALWAYS have two invaders, almost as soon as I step off of the stairs, BUT it never tells me the other guy is there.

I walk in.

A wild 9 SOUL SIGNS appeared!

SOUL SIGNS used SUMMON!

But they all failed!

RANDOMTWEAKER has invaded you!

I proceed to fight this kid. I haven't been in the Forest for 12 seconds so none of the enemies are dead, but they mean nothing to me. Except when they get in the way of backstabbing the enemy, by jumping into the attack. I get the kid in a backstab, but then what was that?!

Another RANDOMTWEAKER spamming GOD'S WRATH has appeared!

With no warning -________-

I kill one and get lagstabbed by the other. Or, my phantom finally summons but can't see the enemy phantoms...

WTH

[LoneSyndal]

No upper limit when invading., but to be invaded, they have to be weaker than you.

[Basukesu]

Well if upping stats won't work anymore, beef up attunement. YOu will be a Glass cannon forever with attunement at 99 =) Though granted def beefs up with each level but hey...Oo

[Garland]

LoneSyndal, on 16 January 2012 - 04:37 PM, said:

No upper limit when invading., but to be invaded, they have to be weaker than you.

Darkmoons have the ability to invade people at a lower SL than the invader.

[SemajChaos]

The invaders weren't the problem as much as lately I have not been warned at all when they appear. I started a new Character (Glass Strength) and while in the Burg, I found two pretty good (tweaking) phantoms. Apparently I was invaded several times, because my phantoms would run back and I'd go and see the invader. But I was never warned.

And the other problem is that I can't seem to connect to Summons much anymore. It's never the other way around; I always work the first time when I put my sign down, but other people's fail more often than not. Even when my host summons another phantom, it'll say failed at least four times before someone works.

[LoneSyndal]

People are so impatient in game and tend to spam their soap stones every 5-10 seconds. Another issue is that other people may be summoning as well considering how big the PS3 population is after the winter holidays.

EDIT: Btw Semaj, should play me in Dark Souls already. ;p

I see you on often but ya dont bother sending messages while I wreck Anor Londo.

@Garland: I was referring to Forest Hunters.

This post has been edited by LoneSyndal: 18 January 2012 - 03:04 AM

[Basukesu]

Anyone here gunning for all the trophies? Or got them all already? Getting all the spells is annoyingly tricky but doable on single playthroughs. My beef is with the blue titanite slab. The fact that you need 2 and that they're only in the crystal cave makes the 2 weapon trophies unappealing. Has anyone got them to drop here?

[Basukesu]

LoneSyndal, on 14 January 2012 - 03:03 AM, said:

Remember that From Software did not make the game mainly multiplayer, its a simple add-on. The game is mostly a single player experience, so they wont bother with balancing PvP all too much.


As for the Glass Cannon thing, that's been a Demon's Souls staple... You maximize one stat, then fill up whatever you want till you reach PvP range. In your case, you're fitted for low-level invasions in Anor Londo (65 range) or some fights in the Kiln. Since you're an STR build with no spells or miracles, might as well do END or VIT to make up for it. There are people who can one shot anyone at your level with one hit from Crystal Magic Weapon.

How do those crystal weapons work? I always hear them being recommended but what exactly do they do in terms of rounding out a huge walloping? What do they modify with?

[LoneSyndal]

Crystal weapons are just uber glassy weapons. They cannot be repaired at the price of major damage, but no enchants and etc.

However, Crystal Magic Weapon (a spell you get from Big Hat Logan in Duke's Archives) scales with Intelligence and does the biggest magic weapon damage increase on any normal weapon.

Another alternative is Sunlight Blade, the faith version of magic weapon and is preferred with Faith/Strength.

[Basukesu]

LoneSyndal, on 08 February 2012 - 10:47 AM, said:

Crystal weapons are just uber glassy weapons. They cannot be repaired at the price of major damage, but no enchants and etc.

However, Crystal Magic Weapon (a spell you get from Big Hat Logan in Duke's Archives) scales with Intelligence and does the biggest magic weapon damage increase on any normal weapon.

Another alternative is Sunlight Blade, the faith version of magic weapon and is preferred with Faith/Strength.

hmm to get the best one you have to kill Gwyndolin right? then join his covenant on the next play through >< that whole thing is broken! lol. Still I hadn't realized that it can do well with strength.

[Jask]

LoneSyndal, on 07 February 2012 - 05:47 PM, said:

Crystal weapons are just uber glassy weapons. They cannot be repaired at the price of major damage, but no enchants and etc.

However, Crystal Magic Weapon (a spell you get from Big Hat Logan in Duke's Archives) scales with Intelligence and does the biggest magic weapon damage increase on any normal weapon.

Another alternative is Sunlight Blade, the faith version of magic weapon and is preferred with Faith/Strength.

Basukesu, on 07 February 2012 - 07:30 PM, said:

hmm to get the best one you have to kill Gwyndolin right? then join his covenant on the next play through >< that whole thing is broken! lol. Still I hadn't realized that it can do well with strength.

Crystal weapons are higher base damage, but low durability and they can't be repaired. Their max durability is reduced to 10% and they cannot be repaired except by further upgrading. They also tend not to improve on scaling as much as getting the weapon to +15 will.

The best magic damage enchantment (at max faith or magic) is Darkmoon Blade while being at +3 in the covenant, but it only beats Crystal Magic Weapon by about five points. Unless I'm remembering wrong.... I was running the numbers a couple days ago. Darkmoon Blade is 1.8x-2.1x magic adjust, while Crystal Magic Weapon is 1.4, but catalysts can get higher magic adjust than talismans can.

This post has been edited by Jask: 08 February 2012 - 07:38 AM

[LoneSyndal]

What Jask says is true. Dark Moon Blade only works as long as you're part of Blades of Darkmoon covenant. It's a miracle-based enchantment and as always, you can only invade those who are guilty and below you in levels.

The reason I choose Sunlight Blade (you obtain after killing Gwyndolin and entering Gwyn's tomb, completely stopping you from joining Blades of Darkmoon) is because you can use it anytime you wish regardless of covenant. Same goes for Crystal Magic Weapon.

As a true glass cannon player, I use several skills at once depending on what I want to do.

If I'm going Magic Based, I'd carry Crystal Magic Weapon, Crystal Homing Soulmass, Acid Spurge, Toxic Mist, Power Within. This goes anti-heavy players and forces them to degrade over time. Most of them run away and tend to be really annoying to fight, so I use mostly chase, stuns, etc. Power Within coupled with Crystal Magic Weapon and Red Tearstone Ring=my ultimate glass cannon killing machine.


If I'm going Faith Based, Sunlight or Darkmoon Blade, Tranquil Walk of Peace, Force, Power Within or Toxic Mist or Acid Spurge. This is my general all-rounder build using Strength and Faith and a Large Club (NOT a great club or club). Similar ring setup as my Magic one, but I'm a glass cannon guy, being hit once is against my code.

[Basukesu]

How about dexterity based weapons? What would you feel is a good set up for those?

I have been running around with a dexterity specialist for a few days now and while fun it does require a lot of prep compared to strength builds. At least in the early half on the game it seems. Once you get past falchions and rapiers.

I am liking the hornet ring and (insert any dagger) so far as my main weapon choice on the Dex build I have.

Another odd question...since damage based on stat increases eventually reach cap. I have found it annoying that element bound weapons cap out much sooner even if their damage is doubled, and am I right in observing that stat boosts no longer apply to those?

If so that is a stinker ><


Also every time I boot up dark souls for some reason....I keep expecting an easter egg Airu to pop on the screen at any moment during the FromSoftware splash screen >.> Lol. sometimes I can't believe they developed the Monhan Diary games lol.

[Jask]

Basukesu, on 14 February 2012 - 10:30 PM, said:

How about dexterity based weapons? What would you feel is a good set up for those?

I have been running around with a dexterity specialist for a few days now and while fun it does require a lot of prep compared to strength builds. At least in the early half on the game it seems. Once you get past falchions and rapiers

Dex doesn't have quite as low of a cap as strength. You'll still gain damage right up to 99 dex. You won't be doing as much damage per hit as a strength weapon, but you'll hit faster. For heavy hitters, the great scythe, Lifehunt scythe, and murakumo are pretty good. I used the great scythe for most of the game on my dex character. It scales well, hits hard, does bleed, has a lot of reach, and you can get it immediately.

Quick weapons work pretty damn well too. They'll do much smaller damage, but you can attack quicker and they're more mobile. Ricard's rapier and the silver knight sword are great, I've used them a lot in PvP. the two swords from Quellag's soul are supposed to be pretty good, especially if you store some humanity, but I think they taper out later on. Should be great for PvE though. I've heard the falchion can be pretty fearsome. Balder Side Sword is pretty popular earlier on, not sure how it turns out later. I love the look of the painting guardian swords. I upgraded one to max, seems alright.

If you don't mind splitting, a lot of people seem to like going dex/int or dex/faith. There are some weapons that go well off the mix. Velka's rapier works good for dex/int, and I think there's one for dex/faith too. The big thing though is to get a +15 dex weapon then cast one of the int or faith buffs on it, like crystal magic weapon, darkmoon blade, or sunlight blade. Prepare for fun and devastation.

All this info is based on PvP talk. A lot of enemies seem to have higher magic defense, but they also have less health and skill than players will.

Quote

I am liking the hornet ring and (insert any dagger) so far as my main weapon choice on the Dex build I have.

Hornet's ring is killer. Try a backstab/parry with that and a +15 or lightning+5 Bandit's knife. This kills the crab. That dagger has the highest critical in the game if I remember right.

Quote

Another odd question...since damage based on stat increases eventually reach cap. I have found it annoying that element bound weapons cap out much sooner even if their damage is doubled, and am I right in observing that stat boosts no longer apply to those?

If so that is a stinker ><

Elemental weapons don't get any stat scaling, which is good. They'd be overpowered if they did. They already beat the hell out of scaling weapons early game. You can't out-damage element weapons until you get to around 40 or so in a stat, unless you enchant the weapons. High damage without leveling. Early game element wins, late game scaling finally gets higher, but often not by a huge amount. What really makes scaling weapons win is enchantments. Raise your stats to where it outdamages element, then enchant it for even more damage. Problem is the enchant spells can be a bit limited in duration and castings.